The Gretsch Pages: Discussions: Miscellaneous Rumbles: A discussion on politics, refined

A discussion on politics, refined - Gretsch style.

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Aug 19, 2008 9:05 p.m. Bear:

I select crowbone as my running mate. We will be the Gretsch Party. Since the Democrats use an ass and the Republicans an elephant, we will choose the Gretsch Falcon as our mascot and symbol. Crowbone, you with me on this?
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Aug 19, 2008 9:10 p.m. crowbone:

Despite my rant Bear, I have too checkered a past to have political ambitions... but I like the Falcon. Almost like an Eagle!

I would be Admiral Stockdale to your Ross Perot.
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Aug 19, 2008 9:17 p.m. Bear:

You and me both crowbone. Once on a job interview I was asked by the interviewer, "Have you ever been convicted of a felony?" My answer was, "Convicted... no."
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Aug 19, 2008 9:23 p.m. Matt:

If Bear gets elected president... all I have to say is good thing I'm a lefty. I play guitar righty too so once he cuts off my right hand, I can just attach a pick to my stub and go right on playing as usual.

I always end up falling into "libertarianism." Small central government enforcing only what the private sector can't do themselves. Big on states rights. Big on social liberalism (government by non-interference). Big on personal responsibility.

The only thing that is currently state run that I believe ought to be somehow influenced by the federal government is education. Everything up to an undergraduate degree should be free, but if you mess up on your way there, oh well. Trade schools are great too.
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Aug 19, 2008 9:26 p.m. CnW:

Matt said: Big on personal responsibility.

So why would he be cutting off your right hand?
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Aug 19, 2008 9:26 p.m. crowbone:

Heh heh, yeah, that always makes them jumpy. Whan asked the same question, I stood up, pointed my finger at him and said in a loud voice " Suspected doesn't mean convicted!, now what's your address?"
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Aug 19, 2008 9:27 p.m. Beatles6120:
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Aug 19, 2008 9:27 p.m. do not be afraid:

my my...
(1) Press 1 for English is immediately banned. English is the official language. Speak it or wait at the border until you can.
who cares? we've gone 232 years without an “official” language, and we've done just fine without it! why waste time and tax payer money trying to get that passed, enforced, etc? because you hate Mexicans? well, sorry, but that's your problem, not the governments!

(2) We will immediately go into a two-year isolationist posture to straighten out the country's attitude. NO imports, no exports. We will use the 'WalMart' policy: 'If we ain't got it, you don't need it.'

(3) When imports are allowed, there will be a 100% import tax on it.

(9) One export will be allowed - Wheat -- The world needs to eat. A bushel of wheat will be the exact price of a barrel of oil.
so that American companies will produce even crappier products, and over-charge us even more? i love those new Ford commercials: “Ford is now the same quality as Toyota!”

(4) All retired military personnel will be required to man one of our many observation towers on the southern border. (Six month tour) They will be under strict orders not to fire on SOUTHBOUND aliens.
yup, that's treating our veterans right! “you've served our country well, but ever since you've been sitting on your ass and wasting your time, so now you're going to come with us and catch those damn Mexicans, or else!" America: like Tolitarinism, only better, and with cheeseburgers!

(5) Social Security will immediately return to its original state. If you didn't put nuttin' in, you ain't getting' nuttin' out. Neither the president nor any other politician will be able to touch it.
honestly, i'm kind of shocked by how tame your policy is! what's with all these cantidates, yourself included, coddling the damned Social Security system?

here's Social Security 101: “you're too fucking stupid to save for retirment, so Big Broth… er, uh, Uncle Sam here is going to take your money and save it for you! and, then, since you're too fucking stupid to know when to retire, we're going to tell you! and, then, once you've retired, because you're too stupid to know how to spend your own money, we're going to tell you how much of it you can spend at a time! but, don't worry, Uncle Sam knows best — and, even if he doesn't, you're so fucking stupid that you'll actually think we're giving you money for retirment, and so you'll support us anyways!”

and that is how it was originally conceived, not the increasingly more insane and starving monster it's slowly been turned into!

(6) Welfare - Checks will be handed out on Fridays at the end of the 40 hour school week and the successful completion of urinalysis and a passing grade.
or, how about we just don't hand out checks at all?! sorry folks, but the government isn't a charity, and, besides, it's more broke than you!

(7) Professional Athletes --Steroids - The FIRST time you check positive you will be banned for life.
because our country has no more pressing concern than what it's athletes jam up their ass?!

(8) Crime - We will adopt the Turkish method: The first time you steal, you lose your right hand. There will be no more life sentences -- if you are convicted of a Capitol Offense, you will be put to death by the same method you chose for your victim, gun, knife, strangulation, etc.
well, no offence, but i think an arm is slightly more valuable than, say, oh, a candy bar! i'm all for the punishment fitting the crime, but not exceeding it! i say: if you steal a candy bar, either give it back, or pay us back! there's no need for any of this silly hand-chopping nonsense!

(10) All foreign aid using American taxpayer money will immediately cease, and the saved money will pay off the national debt and ultimately lower taxes. When disasters occur around the world, we'll ask the American people if they want to donate to a disaster fund, and each citizen can make the decision whether it's a worthy cause.
well, finally something we can agree on! only, what's with this disaster fund nonsense? we already have disaster funds! they're called charities — and, again, in case you need reminding, the government isn't one of them!

11) The Pledge of Allegiance will be said every day at school and every day in Congress -- right after a prayer to God.

(12) The National Anthem will be played at all appropriate ceremonies, sporting events, outings, etc.
what is this really supposed to acheive? indoctrination of our citizens into slaves ready and willing to unquestionably do whatever their government asks, or, uh, what? because that's all i can think of! America: like Tolitarinism, only better, and with a stupid pledge!

i never was very good at that dignity crap! sorry!
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Aug 19, 2008 9:29 p.m. do not be afraid:

eek! when i started writing all that, Bear's was the last post…
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Aug 19, 2008 9:38 p.m. crowbone:

I blame bigalthethird, the agitator.

He stirs the pot, then goes to a baseball game.

Classic!
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Aug 19, 2008 9:49 p.m. do not be afraid:

well…
crowbone: I am discouraged with the bipartisan system, and lack of voter reform.

For too long I have seen the same jerk, different tie.

I would like to see representation that reflects the vote, like Canada has.

I would like to see an end to subsidizing campaigns with taxpayer money.

I would like to determine where my taxes go. It’s my money Damn it. Let me tell you where to put it to work.

I would like to vote on politicians pay raises, and retirements.

I would like to see the end of pork in legislature. One item per vote.
wow, we actually agree!

I would like to see all families eat dinner together as much as possible and make Sunday dinner w/ Grand parents (if possible) mandatory.

I would like to have a winner and a loser in little league, not this “Everyone’s a winner” crap. What lesson does that teach?
or not. i mean, doesn't our government have more pressing concerns than who people eat dinner with on Sunday, or how Little League is run? and, for that matter, isn't telling people who to eat dinner with, and how to run their own sport, and so on, kind of completely un-American?

I would like to see performance based pay for all CEOs with operations in the United States, with no golden parachutes, but penalties, for leaving a company in ruins.

I would like to see the return of manufacturing in America. The CEOs who let this happen see no further than their shareholder’s interests, and that’s bad for the country.
and i guess that kind of extends here! it's not as rediculous as Little League, but why should the government tell companies how to run their business? that's for them to deal with — not you, not me, and not the government!

I would like the president to mandate super fuel efficiency nationwide during his first term, with tax breaks for those who innovate or convert to greener methods.
i think we probably do need higher standards to cut down on polution, but i'm not a big fan of giving tax breaks to anybody, unless they're tax breaks for everybody! subsidizing car companies is not something i see as the proper role for the government!

I would like to see Government respond to the New Orleans’ flood like they responded to Malibu’s fires.
as far as i can see, the government responds to all crises with equal ineptitude, corruption, and bullshit! some are just easier to deal with than others, and make the government look good, while others aren't, and show the government for what they truly are.

I would like to see affordable housing for the average working family.

I would like to see Government run like a Government, not a business. A Government without a heart is nothing more than a corporation. There has to be Welfare, Free Education and Complete Medical Care for those who need it.
i would like to see the government run like a government, not a charity!

Beatles6120:
honestly, i have a hard time understanding how anyone can support any of these candidates! especially when they're dead!
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Aug 19, 2008 9:54 p.m. Bear:

DNBA, I defend your right to be as vocal on this as you choose and your opinions are just as valid as mine although I tended not to resort to immature profanity, but that's okay too. I try to respect any children or ladies that might also take advantage of this forum but it is your right to be vulgar if you so choose. Isn't a free country great?

However, on the social security issue, you left out a very important fact. It is NOT VOLUNTARY. The money is taken out of our checks, without our permission to do so. So why should I not be entitled to get at least some of my money back? There would be plenty of money in social security had not our elected officials used it as their personal slush funds.

Also, those people who were too stupid to save for retirement, I'm sure that those legalized Mexicans whom you state that I hate (I do not by the way), make a superb wage toiling in the fields, working at fast food franchises, or whatever other menial job they can get because they cannot speak English and have plenty of money leftover after payday for mutual funds and IRAs. Now to clarify, I hate illegal aliens of any nationality. What part of illegal is confusing to you? I used the southern border since I don't see a lot of illegal Canadians trying to swim up the Falls.

It is quite obvious you have a lot of disdain for America, the products it produces, and the naturalized (legal in case you're still confused by that term) citizens who live here. May I suggest you move to a country more to your liking; perhaps Cuba, North Korea, or any of the lovely locales in the Middle East. I will gladly donate $100.00 towards a one-way ticket to anywhere you choose to go.

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!

EDIT: DNBA, I wrote this before looking at your profile. I see that you are quite young at 20 so your liberalism is almost a given, kind of like puberty. Once one gets past the acne, the changing of the voice, and the ripening of the cerebrum, conservatism will eventually follow. I retract my $100.00 offer for 20 years. If at that time you still feel the same way, I'll double it.
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Aug 19, 2008 10:04 p.m. do not be afraid:

i think the policies your pushing are much more in line with those of Cuba, North Korea, etc…

oh, and i think the government should give people their social security money back! every last damn cent of it! i just think it should happen now, not whenever, and that we need to stop taking away any more of it! the whole thing was a disgusting mess from the get-go that never should have gotten through congress, or, at the very least, past the supreme court!

and, frankly, i don't think a country where you can be randomly labeled a terrorist, by whoever, without even the slightest hint of evidence, and be thrown in prison forever and tortured, could ever be meaningfully called “free!”
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Aug 19, 2008 10:18 p.m. Bear:

DNBA, I totally agree with your last paragraph. Is America as free as it was just fifty years ago? Absolutely not. However, we as a people can bring it back as long as we're willing to work for it and pay the price. One of the costs is being knowledgeable about politics and how they affect the land you live in and getting off their lazy butts and voting for change rather than just complain about it.

If you took a poll today, I'll bet nearly everyone under the age of 40 could tell you the life history of Paris Hilton or Britney Spears but not be able to tell you a thing about Jack Kemp or Colin Powell.

How can we expect our politicians to improve if the people allow them to be corrupt and incompetent by being apathetic? The fox is not going to remind you to close the gate of the hen house. You need to accept and embrace the responsibility and the privilege.
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Aug 19, 2008 10:22 p.m. do not be afraid:

now that's something we can agree on!
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Aug 19, 2008 10:30 p.m. Bear:

Good, I'm glad we resolved at least some of our differences. Now, don't forget to vote for crowbone and I in November.

Our motto will be: The Gretsch Party for a free America. Mess with us, and you'll get a falcon you'll never forget!
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Aug 19, 2008 10:37 p.m. crowbone:

I was soapboxing there do not be afraid,

Sunday dinner and little league, etc... are pet peeves with me and I was just putting that out there. I don't want the dinner police at my door.

why should the government tell companies how to run their business? that's for them to deal with — not you, not me, and not the government!

We've told them for years how to do business. In fact, NAFTA told them it was A-OK to ship our jobs out of the country, which in turn has sold the middle class down the river. Many countries restrict businesses practices, including the USA. But this is not necessarily a bad thing. It just is when it bleeds your country dry.

i think we probably do need higher standards to cut down on polution, but i'm not a big fan of giving tax breaks to anybody, unless they're tax breaks for everybody! subsidizing car companies is not something i see as the proper role for the government!

Where did I mention subsidizing car companies, or giving them tax breaks? Everybody that falls in line with the new policy will reap the rewards of the tax break associated with it, simple as that. Car manufacturers have been sitting on their hands for generations while gas has climbed in price and now, they are starting to come around, but only after GM lost what, 4 Billion last year? Chickens coming home to roost, I guess, when your biggest sellers are Hummers and Escalades. Time to make that 800 mile per gallon car, eh boys?

as far as i can see, the government responds to all crises with equal ineptitude, corruption, and bullshit! some are just easier to deal with than others, and make the government look good, while others aren't, and show the government for what they truly are.

I suggest you take a closer look. Amongst other disasters, think we handled the aftermath of 911 with Poise, Dignity, Grace and Pride. Relief in the California wildfires arrived while the flames were still licking the sky. Sure NOLA is steeped in corruption, but they were left waiting for relief that barely came. Bodies floating in the streets were left there for volunteers to remove because the relief the Federal Government sent was too thin, feeble, and unorganized to have any effect. This has generated lots of ill will towards the Government, and I think justifiably so. It seems like there is help where there is money and none where there isn’t any.

i would like to see the government run like a government, not a charity!

For a Government to have a charitable arm does not mean that that arm has no strength. Part of the reason we govern ourselves is to also make sure that we take care of ourselves. I suggest you place yourself in the shoes of the homeless, the impoverished, and the indigent and see if you can’t squeeze a bit of empathy out. I keep it in my mind that I am only a few steps away from being in their shoes, and that humility serves as a compass for the way I should treat others. It all gets back to the golden rule.

I understand your loathe for abusers of the system, as I do. It is our money, and I hate to be ripped off, but there are many, many folks who desperately need this assistance just to survive. Keep that in mind before you blow off the whole lot.
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Aug 19, 2008 10:38 p.m. Bear:

crowbone said: I blame bigalthethird, the agitator.

He stirs the pot, then goes to a baseball game.

Classic!

Yeah, but ain't stirrin' the pot fun sometimes? My daughter is a die hard liberal and I can pi$$ her off in a matter of seconds by talking politics with her.
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Aug 19, 2008 10:43 p.m. mainsoda:

I would like a panel appointed to go over all the expenditures the government makes, make a grand list and release it to the public. Then when the American people understand the complete crap we blow money on, a panel of accountants can freely cut all the pork programs. We can each pay a 12% flat tax and we'll all be rich!
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Aug 19, 2008 11:00 p.m. do not be afraid:

crowbone: I was soapboxing there do not be afraid,

Sunday dinner and little league, etc... are pet peeves with me and I was just putting that out there. I don't want the dinner police at my door.
yeah, i kind of guessed that, and actually tend to agree with you on those issues! i was just poking a little fun...

We've told them for years how to do business. In fact, NAFTA told them it was A-OK to ship our jobs out of the country, which in turn has sold the middle class down the river. Many countries restrict businesses practices, including the USA. But this is not necessarily a bad thing. It just is when it bleeds your country dry.
i don't mind all restrictions placed on businesses (like preventing them from selling dangerous products, or using deceptive advertising, etc), but, personally, i think that telling companies who to hire, and where to hire them, and how much to pay them, etc, is crossing the line! yes, we already do that in many ways, but that doesn't make it right…
Where did I mention subsidizing car companies, or giving them tax breaks? Everybody that falls in line with the new policy will reap the rewards of the tax break associated with it, simple as that. Car manufacturers have been sitting on their hands for generations while gas has climbed in price and now, they are starting to come around, but only after GM lost what, 4 Billion last year? Chickens coming home to roost, I guess, when your biggest sellers are Hummers and Escalades. Time to make that 800 mile per gallon car, eh boys?
um, didn't you mention “…tax breaks for those who innovate or convert to greener methods…”, or am i misunderstanding that? i'm fully in support of restrictions on pollutants produced by cars, due to the harm caused by that pollution, but i don't think it should go as far as telling car companies what cars to make, or giving them incentives to make certain types of cars, etc, like a lot of people are suggesting! if people want more fuel efficient cars, they'll buy more fuel efficient cars, and companies will make more fuel efficient cars, and so on, and so forth. i don't think the government really needs to get too involved!

For a Government to have a charitable arm does not mean that that arm has no strength. Part of the reason we govern ourselves is to also make sure that we take care of ourselves. I suggest you place yourself in the shoes of the homeless, the impoverished, and the indigent and see if you can’t squeeze a bit of empathy out. I keep it in my mind that I am only a few steps away from being in their shoes, and that humility serves as a compass for the way I should treat others. It all gets back to the golden rule.

I understand your loathe for abusers of the system, as I do. It is our money, and I hate to be ripped off, but there are many, many folks who desperately need this assistance just to survive. Keep that in mind before you blow off the whole lot.
i fully agree that we need to do everything we can to help the less fortunate among us, i just think that's it's our responsibility as human beings, not our government's responsibility as a government!
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Aug 19, 2008 11:29 p.m. TAG4:

I used to be a yellow dog democrat--When I was a kid there was a lot of Roosevelt and Truman talk at our supper table. Too bad there's no FDR, Harry or Ike in 2008. These days I just don't care who wins the election, I just want Bush, Cheney and Condaleeza to get the hell out of town!

TAG4
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Aug 19, 2008 11:58 p.m. cyclopssam:

This post has been deleted
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Aug 20, 2008 12:11 a.m. cyclopssam:

oh..... there's 9.5 TRILLION PLUS INTEREST reasons to vote "left" this cycle "the grown ups" have proven they can't be trusted withe the bank and i have no idea on how to speak spanish-
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Aug 20, 2008 12:13 a.m. Just Dropped In:

Shouldn't this be in the Soapbox...oh wait, nevermind...LOL
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Aug 20, 2008 4:36 a.m. Ratrod:

All I ask from our 'leaders' is common sense.

Unfortunately that's not very common.