The Gretsch Pages: Discussions: Vintage Gretsch Guitars: WHAT IS IT ABOUT GRETSCH ?

WHAT IS IT ABOUT GRETSCH ?

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- Rated: 18 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 3:27 p.m. jimmy peters:

why is it that gretsch is so popular? it is definately NOT the price.

good luck jimmy peters
- Rated: 12 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 3:50 p.m. Chonny:

Its simply the fact that they are a type of good guitar. There is plenty of other guitar makers out there. I seem to be drawn to Gretsch for their unique styling. I like the volume knob on the horn, Filtertrons, and all the other classic appointments.

I'm the first person to criticize for the lack of non American made production models but the Japanese guitars are just fine so whatever. I've bought about 15 Japanese Gretsches from Joel at Shanghai Music. I am not against Japanese guitars when the build quality is so good.

There definitely has been some price increasing in the past few years. You just gotta find a dealer willing to work with you. If you want the sound buy smart and get a model without all the bells and whistles. The upper level Gretsches that list in the upper 3k range are insanely overpriced for a Japanese made guitar. I see though it paves the way for Fender to bring in the super insane priced US models that are $8k to compete with the handmade archtops I guess lol.
- Rated: 49 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 4:27 p.m. GuitarFarm:

Good question. First, I have a question of my own. Why do you think it is not the price? As far as I am concerned only the custom shop models are expensive. And the 51xx series are downright cheap! Come on. Hollow body for under a grand?

I own two Gretsches. A 6120 and a 6136. While they aren't actually bad guitars, neither are they great ones. And it's not just mine. I've run across some truly horrible 6120s and Country Clubs in guitar stores that had price tags on them that should have made the proprieters blush with shame. I've managed to tweak both of mine into decent playability and still enjoy playing them, but nobody in their right mind would consider them to be the pinnacle of archedtop performance.
I believe it is the kitch factor that makes Gretsch popular. Until about nine or ten years ago not that many people played them. At least not mainstream. Gretsch has managed to catch on in popularity simply because they were unpopular. Players were tired of being associated with Strats and Les Pauls and all the other garden variety guitars available. They turned to Gretsch. They look different, have decent pickups (although somewhat shaky electronics), and set them apart from the crowd. Of course, the fairly recent popularity of Gretsch will no doubt send some of these very same players in search of the next no-name guitar.

So there you have it. Gretsches are simply different. Average build quality, average materials, fair price point, decent playability on certain instruments (usually with some work). Are they ready to take on the big boys in the guitar world? No. But, I don't think they pretend to be. They seem to be happy with the niche market they have.
- Rated: 4 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 5:21 p.m. Remco:

Hmmm..I beg to differ...

My cheapo 5120 blows my '79 Gibson Les Paul out of the water, playingwise and, after I installed TV Jones in them, soundwise as well. So heck yeah!! Even the Korean-made Gretsches are ready to take on the big boys.
- Rated: 49 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 5:58 p.m. GuitarFarm:

Perhaps it does, I've met some really crappy Les Pauls in my time. Specially the later years.

But, if you really believe a 5120 is a great guitar, you either need to get out more or you need to step away from the crack pipe. And I mean no offense by that. I don't know you, nor do I have any reason to dis you. But, come on. A 5120? Look, they're actually pretty decent guitars for what you pay for them. Gut 'em, replace the electronics, and you can actually end up with something that will perform decently. I'm just stating facts. Take on high end archedtops? Not even Gretsch is promising that.
- Rated: 212 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 6:14 p.m. Proteus:

No, Gretsch isn't claiming to take on high-end archtops; no one said they were. While introducing your contrarian contention that Gretschs are cheap guitars, you seem to have introduced that notion as a straw man in order to shoot it down.

I don't know that Gretsch EVER intended to take on Gibson archtops on their own territory.

Perhaps early on, from the late 30s into the early 50s with the Synchros, there was an attempt to build like Gibson.

Perhaps the shallower bodies on Gretsch archtops were originally meant as a way to minimize feedback, but that one design feature has meant that, since the first Gretsch glory days of the mid-50s onward, Gretschs have sounded different. They've been put to different uses than primo Gibby and similar archtops.

While Gibson and Gretsch have shared some interesting construction-and-feature developments at similar times (intonation-adjustable bridges, humbuckers, body stiffening bracing/blocks, thinline design), Gretsch has never since the 50s aped Gibson's archtop approach. Its sound and application has always been its own.

Different guitars, different purposes.

I submit that the classic Gretsch designs are every bit as purposeful and highly evolved as classic Gibson designs, and do what they do to the same degree of perfection.

That's all fellers who like the Gretsch sound ask.
- Rated: 49 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 7:06 p.m. GuitarFarm:

Hey, I like Gretsch guitars as much as the next guy. After all, I still bought another one after already owning one. They have a unique sound due to their peculiar pickups and it is somewhat pleasing to me sometimes. And, I am a hollowbody guitar guy. Heck, I'll entertain the notion of alomst any guitar if it's a hollowbody. Is a Gretsch purposeful? Absolutely. Is it evolved? What is your definition of evolution??? Selling average (6000 series) to semi-average (5000 series) guitars to the masses? If that's evolution, then I guess that they have evolved.

They're an O.K. guitar. Some are pretty good, some are really bad. Most fall in the middle. Who are you trying to kid? We all know about the quality control issues they've had. Like the black sheep in the family, who are we kidding trying to sweep this under the rug? Want to talk about the quality switches and pots? Neck humps? I didn't think so.

I'm not trying to dis Gretsch. I have two of them hanging on my wall. And I have four T-shirts in different colors in my dresser drawer. I would, someday, like to build an amp based on a Gretsch circuit.

I'm just not wearing rose colored glasses is all.
- Rated: 39 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 7:25 p.m. Rocketman:

Ok then they are just expensive?
- Rated: 39 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 7:35 p.m. Rocketman:

The looks and the sound, especially the sound is what makes Gretsch special to me.

I am not fond of the DeArmond pickups, don't know a lot about the others, but I have Hilo's and I just love that sound coming from my Vox amp.

Having been a Beatlesfan all my life may be the reason for that.
- Rated: 30 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 8:03 p.m. WishinforaFalcon:

jimmy peters said: why is it that gretsch is so popular?

They are??

I think we on the GDP get a bit of a skewed view of what Gretsch is in the real world. I don't see very many Gretsches out there at all compared to Strats, Teles, LPs and the like. We all love them and talk about them endlessly, but we are not very many people. The masses have not taken to them NEARLY like we have.

Usually when I talk to the average Joe guitar player about half of the time they don't even know what a Gretsch is, and these guys are 30-40 somethings that have been gigging musicians for years. Sometimes they may say "Oh, my Dad had a Gretsch, those are pretty cool. Now check out my new Strat with Samarium Cobalts."

We at the GDP DO NOT represent the mainstream guitar world.

Just a reality check!!
- Rated: 10 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 9:27 p.m. Daddy-O:

I AGEE WHOLEHARDLY NOT ONLY GRETSCH BUT ANY ARCHTOP !!! THE MASSES WILL NEVER GET IT.
- Rated: 40 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 10:01 p.m. roadjunkie:

I got into Gretsch because it suited my purposes! I had been thru the Fender/Gibson gambit and while happy it wasn't the sound I was looking for. Gretsch has filled that clean and raw sound I was looking for.
- Rated: 42 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 10:09 p.m. Dan:

VERY well said GuitarFarm
- Rated: 7 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 11:39 p.m. Julian:

Why a Gretsch?

I was 14 years old and saw this foreign kid playing a Gretsch in the Ed Sullivan Show. During my youth I was making imprints-----that is one of them.

The sound-------yeah that was also imprinted in my teen blank slate of a brain.

And yes they sound good and look cool.
- Rated: 56 ↑
Nov 17, 2007 11:56 p.m. otterbean:

Nothing like dropping a turd in the punchbowl Guitar Farm. I appreciate your candid nature.Everyone is entitled to their opinion about what sounds good and plays well.

In my case, I went looking for the sound of a Gretsch before I knew that I was listening to a Gretsch. I just got lucky and liked the feel of the guitars I had played as well.

Initially I was just curious about Gretsch guitars because I wanted to play something that appealed to my own interest in the past. I had looked at Gibson archtops and hollowbody guitars first. I couldn't swing the price of those instruments and was really shocked to discover that the tone wasn't what I thought I had been looking for.I liked the feel of the instruments. The problem was that they weren't bright enough for my tastes. There were some very choice Gibson hollowbodies that I played that really shook me, but I couldn't afford them. Why even bother? When I looked at the price tags I couldn't justify the cost.

For me, Dynasonic pickups really do sound better than any other pickups I have heard. I was chasing a particular sound and found something very close when I picked up a 6120 DSW. I'm really torn between the tone of a 6120 with Dynas and a Country Club with Dynas. Either one suits me just fine. I can justify the cost of those guitars. In fact, I think they are reasonably priced. I found the sound, the look, and the feel I was after in one package. Why look any further?

I've also got to add that I currently choose to play a Gretsch acoustic. I am very pleased with the tone. I was absolutely floored by how easy it is to play. I guarantee that it is just as easy on the hands as any Strat I have played. The tone is above par for any sub $1000 guitar. I paid $400 for the Gretsch and haven't looked back. - I've played and heard many old Gibson archtop acoustics, Martins, and modern Taylors. The G3100 I have doesn't match their tone. It comes very close and betters some modern models. I'll put it up against a modern Gibson acoustic any day. I guarantee that it feels better in my hands than a Gibson, Martin, or Taylor. Of course, I didn't have to sell a kidney or my children to afford it either. That is what drove me on my quest to buy what I thought was the perfect acoustic guitar for me. It had everything I was looking for in an acoustic guitar and matched my price point with room to spare.
- Rated: 23 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 12:07 a.m. johnnyringo:

roadjunkie: said: I got into Gretsch because it suited my purposes! I had been thru the Fender/Gibson gambit and while happy it wasn't the sound I was looking for. Gretsch has filled that clean and raw sound I was looking for.

I think all of us probably have our own special reasons for being a part of Gretsch guitars,but that is certainly close to my own reasons roadjunkie.That RAW sound is very very appealing.
- Rated: 29 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 12:09 a.m. SqwareKat:

Hmm, why DO we (I assume you include yourself too, Jimmy) like Gretsch guitars so much? The chicken or the egg? Star Wars or Star Trek? Would the Dolphins have won the Superbowl had the ball's laces been facing OUT? What is the meaning of life anyway? Interesting things to ponder... OK, my head hurts now, and I'm going to bed before my brain falls into a crack in the space/time continuum.

I hope this has been received with the good humor with which it was intended. DON'T OVERTHINK IT! Listen to your ears...
- Rated: 3 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 12:43 a.m. Badams:

Gretsch makes good guitars but they're really not all that popular. I say thank goodness for them because they are a guitar all their own . Just about any of them be it Gretsch ,Gibson,Fender....they're all over hyped and all of them could be built better at a better price.
- Rated: 212 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 1:01 a.m. Proteus:

How could Gretschs be better built in ways which would yield desirable improvements in sound, playability, appearance, or longevity?

What makes any other "premium" guitar objectively better?

And how would applying that betterness to a Gretsch make it a better GRETSCH, as opposed to just "more like a "better" guitar"?
- Rated: 6 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 4:02 a.m. lukess:

This post has been deleted
- Rated: 49 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 6:21 a.m. GuitarFarm:

"...Gretsch has filled that clean and raw sound I was looking for..."

Now that is exactly why I have two of them in my house. I like the Filtertron sound. When I want a little raunch, my two Gretsches, particularly the Falcon, give me a sound none of my others guitars can do. Note - I don't believe in pedals. Oh, I know they exist. I actually seen them. I just choose not to use them.
- Rated: 4 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 6:45 a.m. Remco:

No, no crackpipe in sight.... I'll tell you my reason why I prefer a 5120 over a Gibby (and by the way I've been commented many times on my LP being a good one). First: I'm nearly 2 meters (6 ft 6"); when I pickup a LP it feels like I'm playing a mandolin. Also the weight; if I play the LP for 30 minutes I have the feeling of a hernia coming up. But the actual reason for actually buying the Gretsch; I walked into a musicstore to try one out, purely for fun. I was interested in a lighter guitar, but expected a "cheap" feeling guitar. From the first chord I played I was blown away; I was doing stuff on the guitar I couldn't play on my Gibson. The actual feel was I was playing 0.08 strings, so thing played easy!! Never had that on any guitar; not my LP not on a Strat.

And off course the guitar is a vibe-instrument..no doubt about that...
- Rated: 12 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 9:42 a.m. guitarcapo:

Personally I like them because of the sound. A smaller humbucker has a nicer tone than a standard humbucker because the coils are closer together. You get a richer twangy brightness in the upper harmonics. True hollowbody electrics aren't that common in other major brands...the Epiphone Casino is the only other one that comes to mind. A true hollowbody sounds great played unplugged. I love the sound of an acoustic archtop played unplugged on my couch WITH THE BIGSBY. Where else you gonna get that?

I think if you want an electro-acoustic for playing at open mike night at the local bar, forget about that Taylor with the expression system. Get a Gretsch.
- Rated: 12 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 1:33 p.m. Chonny:

I've said this all before, and I'll say it again just for fun

I used to buy Gretsch guitars (pre and post Fender) like they were water. I was drawn to the styling and the fact that with a bit of change to the Jets or Hollowbodies I can basically get any sound I want out of them (you may be different).

When Fender got in the mix I dumped my Gretsches because I had a feeling that there would be serious changes in the works. I was right. What Fender has done to the Gretsch guitars has totally been a plus. I was extremely anti-Fender during the first months/year of the change. I anticipated a value decrease on my old models. I was off on this as the pre Fenders have not dramatically went down in value. However selling when I did ensured that I did not go in the hole which is my number one factor in buying/selling lol.

I have been waiting and waiting sitting back watching and observing. I and a bunch of friends predicted that we would see production made Gretsch guitars in the USA. I was off on this prediction. I predicted a huge marketing campaign by Fender about US made Gretsches. I can almost see the adds in Guitar Player magezine now. This would allow for them to price the guitar in the Gibson Historic range ($3-6k retail) and compete very well in my opinion as well as compete in the market of PRS and some other high end guitars as well. This would also help raise the "image value" of Gretsch guitars and make them ultimately even more desirable.

What I have seen is less than expected but ultimately I guess just a reality check that Fender bought Gretsch to make truck loads of profit off Terada guitars and thats it. So they have upgraded the old Japanese line a little and inflated the price a lot!

Instead of US production models they have decided to go with the random Custom Shop production of a guitar here and there with insane prices. I would pay lets say around 5-8 grand for a new US made Gretsch but it could not be made by Fender (or Heritage...) and would have to be made in New York by Gretsch. Too bad this is out of the realm of reality. I would take any large sums of cash to the vintage market. Which I'm actually going to do pretty soon.

But the Japanese line does exist for people that want a hollowbody guitar styled like a Gretsch. I think of them more as Terada guitars than Gretsch guitars. I like playing my Terada guitar. I just hope people have the sense to find a good price from a dealer. I would hate to be a guy who paid $3500 for a Reverend Horton Heat model off Musicians Friend.

As far as you saying you've seen Gretsches in stores that basically sucked. I too have seen this but with every guitar manufacturer. This is why I recommend a dealer. If I buy a Gretsch from Joel and it isn't perfect he'll send the damn thing back and request another.

I'm 6'6" tall too. I play my Historic R8 Les Paul. It weighs 8 lbs 10 oz and it feels like any other guitar. Maybe I'm just too young to notice it. I have a Historic '68 Custom that weighs a few more ounces than the R8. Both are good. They don't feel that much heavier than my Silver Jet.
- Rated: 49 ↑
Nov 18, 2007 1:34 p.m. GuitarFarm:

"...A true hollowbody sounds great played unplugged. I love the sound of an acoustic archtop played unplugged on my couch WITH THE BIGSBY. Where else you gonna get that?"

Oh, they can be found. Plus, with a 17" lower bout and at nearly an inch deeper than my 6120, this thing projects. I wish Gretsch would make a deeper hollowbody.